How I drove the FiST and left without wanting to buy one

"Jayhawk Jake" (jayhawkjake) 05/05/2014 at 23:04 • Filed to: FiST

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Okay, put down the pitchforks and torches for a minute while I explain. I test drove a Fiesta ST today, the holy grail of opposite lock. The hot hatch that makes other hot hatches cold by comparison. The choice of so many opponauts that we might as well call ourselves the FiST forum.

Given the way this car is talked about on here, I expected to be blown away. I was afraid to drive it if I'm honest, afraid I'd like it so much I'd commit seppuku for having purchased a Sonic RS only a few weeks before the Fiesta ST hit dealerships. I was afraid that I'd like it so much I'd have to take a huge financial hit on a trade in deal just to have one in my garage.

Fortunately for me, that didn't happen, and I'm going to carefully explain why.

The Challengers

First, lets discuss the cars in question. The FiST I drove was a !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! with cloth seats, nardo grey wheel package, sunroof, and navigation. You know the story but I'll repeat it really quickly: 197 hp, 214 lb-ft torque from a 1.6L Ecoboost engine moving the 2720 pound hatchback through the front wheels.

The FiST was challenging my personal car: a 2013 Black Granite Metallic Chevy Sonic RS

Those of you that frequent oppo know it well, but lets recap. Off the showroom floor the Sonic RS has a 138 hp, 148 lb-ft torque 1.4L Ecotec engine moving 2811 pounds through the front wheels. However, as those who know me are aware, mine is not exactly in showroom condition. I have added the following:

DDMWorks Intake w/ Heatshield

!!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! (note the price has increased since I purchased it)

Trifecta Performance Full Tune

I haven't dyno'd my car, but other people with !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . I haven't run 93 octane, but figure I'm close to Trifecta's numbers which puts me at ~155 whp and 193 wtq. She's a bit down on power, sure, but boy does that torque number look good…

So now that we've introduced our contenders, lets go through some comparisons. I'll try to keep the non-driving points short, but feel free to skip down to them. I don't blame you.

Exterior

Reviewing appearance is always annoying. It's very subjective by nature, and in this comparison it's pretty clear that I'm going to be biased. That being said, the Sonic is a better looking car. Fact.

The Fiesta exudes an air of catfish. I'm sorry, I know that I've probably beaten this joke to death, but seriously: it looks like a god damned catfish, wiskers and all

The Sonic doesn't. It has kickass round exposed headlights with matching round lights in the back. It's also slightly wider which gives it a nice stance when viewed from the front or back. Then there's the doors: The FiST has 4 doors with normal door handles, while the Sonic hides the rear door well, giving it the appearance of a 3 door.

Interior

This is still a bit of a subjective thing, but I think the Sonic interior looks and feels better overall

Ford's interior styling has bothered me recently. Driving both back to back made me realize something though: I would like the Fiesta interior 10x more if the center console was more like the one in the Fusion or Edge, rather than looking like the Xenomorph from Alien exploding out of the car's chest

The picture doesn't really make it very clear, but the way the radio controls jut out makes the cabin feel more cramped than it should. Speaking of cramped, the Fiesta feels quite a bit smaller inside, which is weird because it really isn't. The Sonic is a bit bigger in front, but not a whole lot. In back though, the Sonic is actually measurably and noticeably roomier.

Interesting observation about armrests: the fiesta has a nice pad on the door, whereas the sonic has hard plastic. That's my biggest gripe about the Sonic, if that door panel was padded like the Fiesta it would be a million times better. Another complaint I've had about the Sonic is the useless drivers seat armrest in the center: it's attached to the seat and folds down for the driver only, and it's too short and too narrow to be useful. I leave it up. The Fiesta has a center console storage container, but it's too far back to be useful! I drove around in the Fiesta exactly the same as I do in the Sonic, only my left elbow was slightly more comfortable.

The seats? This was where the Fiesta fell flat on its face. These cloth seats suck.

They're a bit hard. The bolstering is fine but it's not very comfortable It feels cheap, and doesn't look very good either.

On the contrary, the RS seats are amazing. They look incredible with a red RS stitched into the suede insert in the seat back, and an RS logo embossed in the seat bottom. They are super soft and comfortable with ample bolstering that isn't invasive like the Recaro seats in the ST's

This is a big problem to me with the ST. I can't find the Recaro's comfortable, but the alternative is worse. I'd have to get the Recaro's, and while I'm sure I'd get used to them I really wish there was something in between. Leather seats laid out like the cloth ones would be fine, with a little more padding to make it less like sitting on a park bench.

I don't like the steering wheel in the FiST much either. It feels big and cheap, compared to the soft leather wrapped steering wheel the Sonic borrows from the Camaro ZL1

Enough about that, lets get to the meat: how do they drive, and how was I not amazed by the FiST?

Acceleration

In this part of the country acceleration is important. The roads are straight and flat, so most of the time the only fun you can have is being thrown back into your seat as you tear away from a light.

With 194 HP on tap I expected the Fiesta to blow me away. This was where I expected the FiST to truly outshine the Sonic. I mean really, optimistically I have about 160 HP, a full 30 less than the FiST, and I weigh about 100 pounds more. Surely the Fiesta would feel like a rocket.

I gave it the beans a few times, and barely even cracked a smile. 'Eh' is about how I'd describe it. It's quick, but it doesn't really feel that quick. Power delivery is very linear, and while it certainly gets going quickly and pulls well in all gears, it just didn't feel that fast.

Stock, the Sonic doesn't even hold a candle to the FiST. Frankly it's a bit anemic. Tuned is a different story. Around 3000 RPM you really cross the boost threshold and get thrown back as the car hits 22 pounds of boost. When you hit 5500 RPM or so you let off to a resounding 'pshhhht' from the BPV, then give it gas again. The boost comes on and you get thrown back again.

The Fiesta may have more horsepower, but when it comes to torque the Sonic is mighty close to the Fiesta. That's noticeable, and frankly because of the way the Sonic develops power it feels a heck of a lot faster. I know it isn't faster, I know the Fiesta gets to 60 sooner and does the ¼ mile quicker, but it doesn't really feel that way, it doesn't feel as fun. The Sonic makes me giggle every time I really give it the beans.

Strangely that means in my comparison I actually give the Sonic the edge, even though it's slower. It's just more fun, and that's what a hot hatch is all about.

Braking

They have brakes. I honestly didn't try slamming on the brakes in the Fiesta, but it stops. So does the Sonic.

Handling

Okay, I'll concede: the Fiesta handles better. It's pretty damn fun. Corners flat, has a nice bit of looseness in the tail, steering feels great. With that said though, the Sonic is no slouch. There's a bit more body roll and the steering isn't quite as good. If I lived near great driving roads I'd prefer the Fiesta, but for the occasional autocross I feel like the Sonic is good enough. It's still a blast, and while it may not be as fast in corners it gets a little bit more of that 'slow car fast' fun. I definitely still give the nod to the FiST, but that's not to knock down the Sonic at all. Maybe some new springs are due soon…

Ride

While the FiST handles better, it comes at the expense of a somewhat rougher ride. Only a little bit though, and frankly the seats are probably largely to blame here. The Sonic is softer, but it's still a small cheap hatchback with sporty suspension, so it's no Lexus.

Gearbox

Again, FiST wins here. It's a great gearbox. Notchy shifts, fantastic clutch, better pedal placement. The Sonic is okay, I'll report again once I get a short shifter in the relatively near future.

Audio

There's a nice rumble in the FiST, but it almost feels artificial. I know Ford works some voodoo magic to get more engine noise in the cabin, and maybe I'm just imagining things but it made it feel like the sound was coming from the wrong place. I can't quite explain it but it felt a bit off, even if it did sound good. There's zero turbo noise though, and that's unfortunate. Nothing. No spooling turbo, no whooshing air, no blow off...I want to know it's a turbo, because turbo engines are awesome.

My Sonic is very clearly a turbo. You hear the air rush in under power and get a resounding blow off when you let off. It's so much fun. Plus the ZZP catback sounds great, nice and throaty without being too loud, and in the right conditions you get a bit of burble. It's not as good as an Abarth, but I like it a lot. My Sonic wins here

Toys

The Fiesta has more of them, but only just. Push button start is neat, built in navigation is nice, automatic climate control is great. I still prefer MyLink to Sync though, and manual keys and climate control aren't the end of the world. The FiST wins here, but it should: it costs more

Value

Ah yes, value. The FiST I drove stickered at $24,755. My Sonic's sticker was $21,220. That's a difference of $3,535. That's a pretty significant difference, and my Sonic came with those kickass leather seats. If I want nav it's a $50 app, and while I lack a sunroof at least I have kickass leather seats.

But of course, this Sonic isn't stock. Add the $190 intake, the $360 exhaust, and the $315 tune and you've added $865, which is a heaping...well, still not the $3,535 it would take to get the FiST. Add some new springs for $300 or so and a short shifter for $200 and you've still got a solid $2300 before you match that FiST.

And before you say 'but Ford is offering discounts and special financing', realize that Ford isn't the only one offering it. I certainly didn't pay sticker price, and there's no reason you would.

Oh, and both get about the same MPG if you're into that sort of thing

Conclusions

If you've stayed with me so far, thank you. What did I take away from all this?

First of all, the Fiesta ST is a fantastic little car. It really is, and I certainly didn't write this intending to bash it or steer anyone away from one. That being said, it's not the only option you have in this market.

The Sonic RS tends to be overlooked on numbers alone, and what I hope I've demonstrated here is that it shouldn't be. That's not to say you should buy one, but if you do you certainly haven't gone wrong. It's a fantastic little car in its own right.

Another interesting takeaway from this is the value of modifying a car. The Sonic is alright stock, but a few bolt-ons brought it up to snuff with easily the best performing car in the class, but more importantly they made it my own. It's my Sonic RS, not just a Sonic RS. My Sonic is a ton of fun to drive. My Sonic accelerates like a bat out of hell. My Sonic looks damn fine during the few moments it's clean.

I love my Sonic, and ultimately that's all that matters. I'd probably say the same thing if I had bought a Fiesta. Drive what you love no matter what anyone else says, and don't feel pressured to pick a car just because everyone on here seems to love it. When it comes time to shop for a car, don't overlook a car just because it's numbers don't seem impressive. You just might come away surprised.

Vicente Esteve > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:11

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Mandatory

Manuél Ferrari > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:15

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Jimmies are going to be rustled!

Logansteno: Bought a VW? > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:16

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I always knew the Sonic RS was a tune and some mods away from being great. You've just backed my thoughts up completely. And it doesn't look like a damn fish.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:20

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I don't have much to say, other than like Rusto said: Jimmies are rustled!

I do respect your opinion on the two and You've actually got me interested in learning some about the Sonic, not that I'm in the market now.

Respectfully, I'd have to take the FiST for the interior and handling, I didn't get to test drive one so I cant say for sure how I feel about acceleration; but comparing to a FoST it probably wouldn't be as good as I'd hope.

This was a great read, and definitely something I hadn't considered. Never thought about comparing the Sonic to a FiST in any scenario. I'm genuinely glad someone else did, thanks! :)

Mathias Rios > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:20

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My stance on this would be;

"Say No To Aveo"

but then again I haven't driven either of them so who am I to talk.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:20

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Such rustling!

Jayhawk Jake > Mathias Rios 05/05/2014 at 23:22

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The Sonic =/= The Aveo.

It's honestly one of the most incredible turnarounds in automotive history from one model year to the next.

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:22

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First rule of Oppo: don't talk shit on the Miata

Second rule of Oppo: don't talk shit on the FiST

There are no more rules

Jayhawk Jake > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:23

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Well, yes, but that honestly wasn't my goal. My goal was to present the Fiesta ST from a different perspective than normal and balance out the Fiesta love on Oppo.

The Transporter > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:24

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The Sonic is a worthy (and underrated) contender.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:24

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Third rule of Oppo: Say shit about Porsche when K-Rolls around, you're gonna have a bad time! :P

Manuél Ferrari > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:26

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Don't worry I was just kidding. It was a good post. You didn't say anything mean.

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:27

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Uh oh I better be careful. I say shit about Porsche sometimes. Not cause I hate them (obviously). I just don't like some of their decisions...

Jayhawk Jake > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:27

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My pleasure.

I kept going back and forth in my head on the interior when driving back in the FiST. I wanted to like it, I really did, but the Sonic is just better IMO. The FiST gives off this feeling that it's almost trying too hard.

I'm curious to see what Chevy does for the next Sonic. The Sonic interior is starting to show it's age a little bit compared to the Fiesta, which isn't really surprising considering it's been around since 2011 I believe. There's plenty of room for improvement, and I think the Trax is a decent preview of what might come

Basically the same style, but it looks like some nicer materials all around and a better layout on the doors.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:28

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Which decisions? And some can be tolerated of course. :P

Forgetful > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:29

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I applaud your decision because I also chose a slower, better looking, simpler car over a faST Ford, just instead of a Fiesta it was a Focus, and instead of a Sonic I bought my FR-S.

So now you can say that your Sonic is pretty much a GT 86 hatchback.

Jayhawk Jake > The Transporter 05/05/2014 at 23:30

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I'm excited to see what happens for the next refresh of the Sonic. It should get one in 2015.

If Ford keeps making the Fiesta ST I hope Chevy steps up with either a more RS worthy Sonic RS or a Sonic SS. They've got some performance parts that are supposed to be available this year that are a step in the right direction, but they have a good foundation for a proper hot hatch and plenty of engineers around the world that can get it right

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:30

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I plead the 5th!

Mathias Rios > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:31

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I mean I did a little research on the Sonic etc, and wikipedia has them listed on the same page; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet…

The sonic doesn't even have it's own page. Apart from styling and interior is the chassis different? Again I am not knowledgeable about either of these cars but I have heard the worst things about the Aveo (from GM employees, and haven't heard anything about the Sonic) and nothing but praise for the Fiesta ST.

Patrick George > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:32

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Funny you should bring this up, I drove a Sonic RS for the first time tonight and enjoyed it immensely. You're right that it's not quite as potent as the Fiesta ST in the speed department, but it is quick, tossable, has a great gearbox and is extremely fun. I'm a fan.

Congrats on your purchase.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:35

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I agree about age. the Cruze is showing it's age too, and if the materials in the Cruze are anything like the Sonic, then they felt really plastic-y and hard IMO. I do like the style, but it's time for something new. I like everything about the Trax but the gearbox area, much too generic and dull compared to the rest of it.

I liked the Fords because their interior's looked so outlandish and alien-like.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:39

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You did what?

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:41

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Nothing. Nothing to see here.

(hides in corner)

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:42

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Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:44

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Jayhawk Jake > Patrick George 05/05/2014 at 23:45

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Thanks. It's a nice little car that tends to get thrown under the bus for only having 138hp.

JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t > Jayhawk Jake 05/05/2014 at 23:46

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As a (just-damaged-by-a-fucking-rabbit-strike-tonight :P ) FieSTa owner, I can agree with your evaluation of the seats, the acceleration, and the interior for the most part (I have the same problem with the Recaros that you do, and the same complaints about the cloth sport seats you do) but the real party trick is flogging the little bugger on a twisty secondary road. When the going gets un-straight is where the FieSTa goes from a quick little econo-car to "Muhahahahahahahahah! I can't believe this! Hehehe! Oppo! Blammo! Pow! Zip! *giggle* oh shit i'm going like 3.5 times the speed limit... ahem. I'll just slow down now..." Of course, I live in Vermont, where they don't know the meaning of a straight line...

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:50

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Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:51

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LOL

You have defeated me. I can't out-meme those memes

Jayhawk Jake > Mathias Rios 05/05/2014 at 23:52

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The Sonic is marketed as the Aveo in some parts of the world

Your answer is right in the article you linked. The 2011+ Aveo (Sonic here, Holden Barina in Australia) is on the Gamma II platform .

The chassis was designed by GM Korea (Daewoo) with help from Opel, styled by a Holden designer, with suspension tuned by Corvette Racing.

So to reiterate, the Sonic is not the same old Aveo in new clothes. It's a completely new car that happens to be in the same size class.

You'll also notice I didn't dislike the driving dynamics of the Fiesta. In fact, I repeatedly said it's a great car, and it is. My point wasn't to shit on the Fiesta, my point was that from the perspective of someone who owns a competing car, the Fiesta isn't THAT incredible. It's a good car, and I acknowledge that it's faster and better handling than the Sonic, but the Sonic holds its own surprisingly well.

Jayhawk Jake > JawzX2, Boost Addict. 1.6t, 2.7tt, 4.2t 05/05/2014 at 23:54

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It did handle really well. I was very impressed by it. Then I took the Sonic to the same road and tried it, and while not as fast as the Fiesta, it was every bit as fun.

I also suspect some of the handling differences have to do with the tires...I really need some summer tires.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:55

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Yay!! So what'd you do? Can't be that bad....Right??

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:56

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I think the 991 C2 is an expensive turd.

(I do love the 911 C2S though!)

Jayhawk Jake > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/05/2014 at 23:58

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The plastics are rather plastic like, but the vast majority of places you actually touch are great. The only place I really don't like in the Sonic is the door. The window line is hard and narrow, and the armrest is too hard. I'd like to find a shop that does custom interiors and see if they can make me a cushioned armrest for not too much money.

I don't like the outlandish and alien like Ford styling. I had a rental Focus for about 3 weeks and I hated the center console. I think the way they have it laid out in the Edge and Fusion is fine, I really wish that style would trickle down.

There were some spyshots of the 2016 Cruze a week or so ago, it looks promising

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/05/2014 at 23:59

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.............

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:01

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I really don't like it! I think it's a travesty that Porsche made it and charges as much as they do. It's so underpowered compared to the competition that they should just call it the 912 despite it having 6 cylinders!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 00:02

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A change of topic right quick, I thought it was gonna look like this?

I do like the Fusion interior styling though; I'm just not sure if I could see it in the Focus or Fiesta, or a compact in general.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/06/2014 at 00:06

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But Porsche always needs a Carrera! Not just a Carrera S. I'm not sure what it's entire competition is like, but I think it's plenty powerful for what it is. I do agree that an $84-86k base price is a bit much perhaps, maybe around $70k would have been better??

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:09

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I know! I do want them to have a base Carrera. I just think that they either need to make it cheaper or make both the Carrera and Carrera S more powerful.

The C7 Stingray is WAY cheaper than the Carrera and has the power of the Carrera S!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/06/2014 at 00:12

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I think in my world, making the base Carrera cheaper would work. But more power would be nice; but no more than 400hp.

DirtyBird > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 00:13

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Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:14

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I think cheaper would be better too! Get more people in the 911!

Then they'll become 911 addicts and buy the more expensive models when they make more money.

banjo cat ghost of oppo past > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 00:15

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Just poppin' in to say thank you for resisting the urge to peel out for the first 15 feet of the autocross course unlike the chode infront of you.

Need to step my game up I remember when 20psi got you looks of bewilderment or just the stinkeye.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/06/2014 at 00:16

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Exactly!!

DirtyBird > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 00:21

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If the gearbox is anything like the focus st I woukld have to disagree on the notchy feel, it was anything but.. for referance I daily drove a 2000 trans am with a 6 spd at the time I drove a st

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:22

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I think the world will be a better place if there are more 911s on the road. Porsche shouldn't be exclusive like Ferrari. The beetle was for the masses. The super beetle should be for the (hard working) masses too!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/06/2014 at 00:26

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K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 05/06/2014 at 00:39

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MOAR 911s!!!!

Jayhawk Jake > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:43

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That's the 2015. Spy shots are of the 2016

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 05/06/2014 at 00:48

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So many 911s!

911s everywhere!

ME GUSTA

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 00:51

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Oh. That seems odd to me. Why refresh then re-do the entire car in two years?

shpuker > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 01:44

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Everyone always gives me weird looks when I hardcore MEH the Focus ST, but I really wound up with similar conclusions.

Hell ever comparing the Veloster Turbo to the Focus ST (given the Focus I drove was a year old) I wound up walking away wanting the Veloster far more. Not that I disliked the Focus, it just falls short in some areas, and the Veloster is kick ass. When I was looking for a car though I looked at the Veloster, Focus ST, older WRX, and the BRZ, and honestly, the Focus was at the bottom of that list.

The Transporter > Mathias Rios 05/06/2014 at 03:17

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Having seen a ton of Aveos and Sonics side by side over the past few years, I can tell you that the Aveo's T200 platform is, in fact, the basis for the Gamma II. All of the basic dimensions are the same and with some of the later T250s, you could almost convince yourself that you could take an Aveo and with a few interior pieces and body panels you could make a Sonic.

However, when you start to look closer you realize that it's not just a matter of swapping out the headlights and a front grill. Every single body panel is slightly different. You start changing one, you have to change them all. The suspension is similar - McPhersons and A-arms up front, twist-beam rear - but not equal. The twist-beam rear could probably be swapped back and forth, the mounting points look the same, but the beam is much more evolved and it looks like its based on the design used in the Cruze. The wheel hubs are completely different - 4 lugs on the Aveo, 5 on the Sonic - and the brakes are vastly improved. The engine and tranny comes from the Opel's Gamma I platform and blows the antiquated Daewoo kit completely out of the water. And I haven't even talked about the interior yet. Even though the Sonic's interior is starting to show its age and feels kind of plastic-y, human languages lack the words to properly describe how far apart they are. All in all, the only parts that are the same between the two are parts that you can't see unless you're at the beginning of the assembly line.

The reason why you haven't heard anything about the Sonic is that GM has never been able to properly market anything that has less than 8 cylinders, especially if it's FWD. The only bit of marketing I've seen for the Sonic was a bunch of hipsters dancing around a Sonic to a Fun song and the only commercial I've seen with a Cruze in it centers on the fact that it comes with a 5-year maintenance package. I wonder why they aren't selling.

Tom McParland > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 08:27

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I happen to really like the RS and the ST, though I am beyond the stage in my life where I can justify owning such small cars. Here is my issue with the RS, and this is purely personal....GM could have tuned that thing to the power levels you have now for the same damn price and folks like yourself would not have to look to the aftermarket. The fact that Chevy only upgraded the brakes, suspension and other bits without adding more power was a let-down for me. If they are going to make an RS model as their top-tier sporty hatch it should have more power than the others.

Brian Silvestro > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 08:29

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Jayhawk Jake > Tom McParland 05/06/2014 at 08:46

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Very good point, and I agree. Chevy is going to offer a stage kit now with an intake and tune that adds some power, why they didn't do that for the RS in the first place is beyond me.

Of course, the RS badge is really just an appearance pack these days at Chevy, so it's nice that for the Sonic it added something . Look at the Cruze or Camaro: RS just adds some flashy bits.

Jayhawk Jake > Brian Silvestro 05/06/2014 at 08:48

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Jayhawk Jake > banjo cat ghost of oppo past 05/06/2014 at 08:50

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The guy in the FR-S is actually a really good driver and a nice guy. He was just having fun, there's nothing wrong with that.

thebigbossyboss > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 09:49

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Many no lense headlight.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 09:51

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2 things

1) Spend the 500$ on the cobb stage 1 tune for the FiST and your tuned sonic will only see the tailights of the Fiesta. Doubly so on a twisty road where the Fiesta really shines. Plus once both drivers have done that the warranty goes out the window which is probably not the smartest idea for a DD. At least, I probably won't flash tune mine for a year or two so for leaving a car stock? Fiesta all the way.

2) Having sat in and driven both, the Sonic still gets called "Aveo" by me because it still feels cheap. Not everything in the fiesta feels premium and some of the little bits and pieces are below average when compared to a corolla or civic or fit but it feels so much more tightened down than the sonic does.

2.5) Had I already had a very new car of almost any sort, I would've made the same decision. To be honest, I would call you out on being stupid if you spend the time/money to buy, finance, and tune your sonic just to throw it out for another car of the same size and use. If you needed a vehicle that's easier to get a car seat in and you want some more room for groceries or that can tow a small trailer? Perfectly valid reason. "It's faster while also being more expensive and isn't any igger or more useful to me" isn't worth the 3k hit you take on your car for depreciation AND the 2-4k gap in price.

thebigbossyboss > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 10:09

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Too many buttons batman! Agreed Sonic 1 Fiesta 0

Brian Silvestro > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 10:13

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You stole this from me.

Jayhawk Jake > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 05/06/2014 at 10:15

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1) The FiST already costs more than the Sonic, even with all the mods I've done, so adding another $500 on it just furthers my point in comparing the two

2) Whatever, it's not a freaking Aveo. Having sat in and driven both they are on par with each other as far as quality, especially the RS trim. The only place the Sonic feels cheaper than the Fiesta is the door panel and lack of automatic climate control.

Jayhawk Jake > thebigbossyboss 05/06/2014 at 10:17

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I'm very, very worried this will go away with the next refresh. It's the best design feature of the car.

thebigbossyboss > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 10:21

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No yellowing. Which reminds me I should adjust my headlights before I commence my road tripping at the end of next week which will consist of one 6 hour drive, one 8 hour drive and one 12 hour drive.

Jayhawk Jake > Brian Silvestro 05/06/2014 at 10:27

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And you stole it from the internet

Brian Silvestro > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 10:30

1

anothermiatafanboy > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 10:50

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Well written post, but it seems to me it was biased, and due to the fact that you already owned and modded one of the vehicles, the FiST was doomed from the start. It sounded like you were just trying to justify the Sonic. Nice seats tho..

AChinaGhost52 > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 11:01

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I always call the Sonic the baby Evo, because they look similar to my X to be honest

Jayhawk Jake > anothermiatafanboy 05/06/2014 at 11:13

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It was obviously biased, but I wasn't trying to justify the Sonic.

In fact, when driving the Fiesta and discussing it with the salesperson, I was trying to justify the Fiesta. I was trying to convince myself that it was the amazing car that Oppo loves, and in many ways I did: It is a fantastic car to drive. It handles better than any other car in its class, the clutch and shifter are among the best I've ever used, and it's certainly got power.

That being said, in many ways it wasn't what I was expecting. Blame hype or bias, but it didn't blow my socks off. As I believe I mentioned in the article if I was shopping between the Sonic and Fiesta without already owning a hatchback I'd probably have picked the Fiesta.

Ultimately, the conclusion I come to is the FiST is a great car, but the Sonic is too. Building on that I think if Chevy would give the Sonic a little more power, better tires, and a little more aggressive suspension it's be a really, really good contender for the hot hatch crown.

Jayhawk Jake > AChinaGhost52 05/06/2014 at 11:15

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Some people like to plastidip the front to look like an Evo, and some people in Thailand actually made a front bumper to be evo like

Mathias Rios > The Transporter 05/06/2014 at 11:28

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Thanks for the explainer. As you said, seeing them side by side, it sort of looks like a facelift but it appears I am wrong.

Mathias Rios > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 11:28

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Thanks for the clarification.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 11:35

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1) the fiesta ST costs more because it is a much more complete upgrade over the base car. As an overall performance package the ST also blows the RS away.

2) I've been in the cruze. I know how GM can make a small car interior. The cruze is another korean designed and built (well originally built in korea) compact and it is worlds ahead of the sonic IMO. The sonic has an okay interior on its own and it feels downright poor compared to the cruze when I sit in the two back to back.

BillGK > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 11:49

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Elephant ears

BillGK > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 11:54

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"My Sonic's sticker was $21,220" Is the warranty still valid on your Sonic with the exhaust, ECU and intake addition?

Jayhawk Jake > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 05/06/2014 at 11:54

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1) Really the only difference between the Sonic upgrade and the Fiesta upgrade is the Fiesta has a different engine. Everything else that's different in the ST from the stock Fiesta is different in the RS compared to an LTZ. Different transmission, different interior, different suspension, different brakes, different exterior pieces (bumpers and spoiler), different wheels...

Seriously, everyone hangs up on the motor for the RS. The motor is the same so it's just an appearance pack, except it really isn't.

2) The Sonic is built in the US, just to be clear. I wouldn't consider the Cruze to be on a wholly different level than the Sonic, but that's my opinion. It should be better because it costs more, just as the Focus should be (and is) better than the Fiesta. I don't think the Fiesta is poor quality on the interior (except the cloth seats are terrible), but I don't think the Sonic is either. The Sonic isn't as good as the Fiesta, but it's also older, so it's definitely more comparable to the Fiesta that was around when the Sonic came out in 2011. My issue with the interior on the Fiesta comes down to styling and layout. I'm not a fan of the style, and the layout makes it feel oddly cramped to me.

Jayhawk Jake > BillGK 05/06/2014 at 11:58

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But of course, this Sonic isn't stock. Add the $190 intake, the $360 exhaust, and the $315 tune and you've added $865, which is a heaping...well, still not the $3,535 it would take to get the FiST. Add some new springs for $300 or so and a short shifter for $200 and you've still got a solid $2300 before you match that FiST.

Installation costs are basically irrelevant, you can do all of this yourself. I installed the intake and applied the tune myself (tune needs a $150 cable, but I got it for free or they'll loan you one, so no cost), the exhaust was just a bolt on but I took it to a shop and it cost ~$75 to have them install it.

banjo cat ghost of oppo past > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 12:10

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Sentiment shared I do hard launches spinning 4 on the dd tyres in practice runs or those after event freebies.

BillGK > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 12:12

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And after the ECU, exhaust, intake, suspension, transmission modifications you did, is the warranty still valid? Or are you planning to put back the OEM stuff whenever you get an engine issue and pretend to the dealership that you don't know why you got that engine light lol?

BillGK > Forgetful 05/06/2014 at 12:15

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The FR-S is at least handling better than the Focus ST and it's RWD. I don't see any correlation with the Sonic vs Fiesta ST other than both are slower than their competitors...

Jayhawk Jake > BillGK 05/06/2014 at 12:18

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Well, no one has had issues caused by the modifications to this point. Regardless, unless the dealer can prove that the modifications caused the issue the warranty isn't void.

GM has performance parts listed in their catalog now that do similar things without voiding the warranty. I'm really curious to see how much they cost whenever they release, it should be a good option for people worried about the warranty.

Forgetful > BillGK 05/06/2014 at 12:19

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It's a bit of an inside joke because I admitted to Jake that I have a crush on his Sonic.

BillGK > Forgetful 05/06/2014 at 12:21

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It's a nice car, more "traditional" hatchback than the Fiesta for sure. I just hope that 1.4 turbo does not end up in the new Miata though...

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 12:25

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1) You're underselling the ST's upgrades. Yes both have had the same areas affected but the ST has taken each one further. The sonic doesn't ride that much lower or stiffer than the ST. You saw this yourself, it cushions imperfections on the road better but at the cost of the higher levels of control that the ST gives. So while the RS package gives the sonic similar upgrades, they have different goals in mind. I'd say the RS package is summed up as "A sonic, but better" where the ST package is "A conversion package to turn a fiesta into a performance vehicle"

2) I know it is, but here's my logic. Having grown up in a GM household, the cobalt deserved every mention of the cavalier in every comparison. It made the same mistakes and was built the same way and it was literally "The cavalier, again" with only the SS models standing out. The cruze changes that. It seems like they finally pulled their heads out of their asses, understood what needed to be done, and have found success because of it. But the sonic? I had high expectations of the sonic I guess, but compared to all trim levels of its competition it is in the typical GM last place for the usual reasons of poor materials, bland design, etc....If you like it, more power to you, but it isn't a complete departure from the aveo. Not yet anyways.

Jayhawk Jake > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 05/06/2014 at 12:41

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1) The ST has some modifications and sits .6" lower. The RS has some modifications and sits .5" lower. I don't understand your point.

2) It's a total departure from the Aveo. You seem dead set on convincing yourself it's just an Aveo, but it really, really isn't.

Could it use more upgrades? Absolutely. Is it perfect? No, but neither is the Fiesta. Regardless, the Sonic is a fine car, and most reviewers have received it well.

Remember, I'm not saying the Sonic is better than the Fiesta. In fact, I'd even concede that the Fiesta is a better car right now, and if someone was in the market they're probably better off with a Fiesta, but that's not to discount the Sonic, which is something you seem very desperate to do.

anothermiatafanboy > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 13:09

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well said.

Garrett Davis > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 13:34

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Aw man, now I have to go drive the Sonic again.

This was a good read, though I should point out that the Fiesta is severely underrated from the factory on torque especially. TST dynoed theirs at 230 ft lbs stock. I'd say the Fiesta is the better car to drive, but the Sonic is still a fun drive. I just wish they would have spent some money on the engine, because it is a bit of a dog stock. For example, my 318ti also has 138hp but it weighs a good 200 lbs less, and after driving my ST for a while, I got back in that thing and panicked for a second because I thought it was down on power.

I agree about the interior of the Fiesta, it still feels a bit cheap, but the worst plastics in the Fiesta are better than the worst plastics in the Sonic. I know you don't like them, but the regardless of how comfortable you find them, the Recaros are extremely high quality, and automatically bump up the Fiesta's interior score by a ton. That said, the leather seats in the Sonic are quite nice for an econobox.

My biggest problem with the Fiesta was how cramped the interior is. That is the reason why I came out of the dealer with a Focus ST instead. The torque didn't hurt either, but I needed practicality first.

Thanks for the update! Glad you got to clear up whether you made the right choice with the Sonic. At the end of the day, you've got to enjoy what you drive, anything else doesn't matter.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 13:38

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Ha!

Jayhawk Jake > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 05/06/2014 at 13:52

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Someone with photoshop skills should do a better job. I just cut and pasted stuff in paint

Jayhawk Jake > Garrett Davis 05/06/2014 at 13:58

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The Sonic feels anemic stock compared to both the Fiesta and the tuned Sonic. Chevy owes it to themselves to tune that engine to have more power from the factory.

I'd agree about the worst plastics - worst plastics thing, but Chevy does make generally wise decisions about where to put the crappy plastics. The center console, for example, is super cheap and shitty, but you NEVER touch or or see it. Honestly, as I've said I few times, the only part of the Sonic that really NEEDS an upgrade is the door panel. The display surround looks a little cheap on mine, but on the 2014 RS they made it piano black which does look quite a bit nicer

I want to love the STs, I really do. Unfortunately they just don't appeal to me in their current skins. The powertrains are amazing, but the bodies just don't excite me.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 14:07

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And that's what makes it... fantastic.

Especially adding the badge.

themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 16:19

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"but that's not to discount the Sonic, which is something you seem very desperate to do." I'm far from discounting the sonic. I'm saying its interior isn't as good as GM's other products which include another small car based on a korean design that replaced a much loathed car for being cheap and overall a below average car. The ST's cabin isn't a world leader by any means itself but I think the little touches they did for it make it feel and look better despite the touchscreen sound system being subpar. But did you forget what I said at the outset? If I was in your shoes, I'd come to the same conclusion at the end.

Here's what I've been trying to convey to you - They're not the same car . What you've done is take a spin of the car around town and maybe down a bend or two. If that's how you intend to drive the car 99% of the time, then you make a fair point on the fiesta not being anything special. But if you aren't really pushing the ST, then you haven't experienced why people love it and where the extra money the ST costs goes to. Good suspension doesn't make traffic and the daily grind more fun. And the recaros will make bumper to bumper traffic a pain unless it's cold out and you have the heated seats to alleviate it a bit. Anyone who says it is a flawless traffic car is lying. I freely admit to that. My commute isn't magically better being in my ST over my jetta. But when I went out for some aggressive driving through some twisty lakeshore roads, THAT was where the smile came onto my face. I'll gladly pay the entry fee and put up with the bumps on the road (still infinitely smoother than any car on coilovers) for that feel at the limits and the autocross potential. But that's me. Obviously it isn't you.

Jayhawk Jake > themanwithsauce - has as many vehicles as job titles 05/06/2014 at 16:28

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I didn't know you were in the car on the test drive to know what all I did.

I went to a lake shore road and took it around quickly, the same road where they were clearing hay bales from a go kart race last weekend. Was I pushing it super hard? No, it's not my car. But I got a really good feel for it, and it handles really well, in fact, as I said I think it's the best handling car in it's class.

What surprised me was how fun the Sonic still was on the same road, because when I was done with the Fiesta I took the Sonic to the same road and drove it the same way. Was the Fiesta better? Of course! Was it so much better that it makes the Sonic look like a piece of crap by comparison? No, and yet that's what some people on here seem to say about the Sonic (not you, but it gets shit on a lot).

Again, would I have bought the Fiesta instead of the Sonic at the time I bought the Sonic? For the right price, yes. However, having experienced both, I guess what I really take away is how underrated the Sonic is compared to how overrated the Fiesta is. Both are fun little hatchbacks, and while the Fiesta is better in some ways the Sonic is better in others. They trade blows more than people are willing to admit, and ultimately that's why I chose to write this article. I wanted to illustrate the point I've tried to make whenever someone writes off the Sonic RS: it's not a car that should be written off, because even though the Fiesta is great it's not the only fun hatchback on the market today.

wiffleballtony > Jayhawk Jake 05/06/2014 at 22:42

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In all honesty this felt more like you were trying to reaffirm your purchase rather than doing a fair comparison. Did you drive the FiST prior to the Sonic RS purchase? Secondly you're comparing a stock car to a modded car, hard to do an apples to apples comparison. Thirdly, your views on aesthetics are not fact.

Jayhawk Jake > wiffleballtony 05/07/2014 at 00:05

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I wasn't trying to reaffirm my purchase, I was presenting the FiST from my perspective, that being the perspective of a modded Sonic owner.

No, I did not drive a FiST before I bought the Sonic, they weren't on sale yet.

It wasn't meant to be an apples to apples comparison, it was meant to be a comparison of the FiST I drove and the Sonic I own. Regardless of that, it was also meant to be a comparison of two cost competitive cars, so with the Sonic + upgrades costing less than the Fiesta I think it's a fair comparison and one that we seem to talk about a lot (for that money you could buy x and do y)

Oh and yes, my views on aesthetics are fact. Forget that I said multiple times it was subjective and generally expressed them sarcastically as being factual. The Fiesta does in fact look like a catfish, and the Sonic is in fact a better looking car.

wiffleballtony > Jayhawk Jake 05/07/2014 at 00:59

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Lol fair enough, sarcasm doesn't always convey through these interwebs

Dsscats > Jayhawk Jake 05/07/2014 at 23:35

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Needs just a little more low and a little darker wheels to have the absolute perfect stance.

BadMotorScooter > Jayhawk Jake 05/07/2014 at 23:45

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Interesting read, thanks for posting. One thing often missing in comparisons like this is the real world pricing data. You noted the Sonic is $3500 less based on MSRP, but it is actually more than that. I've been lightly shopping these cars and I can get a new Sonic RS manual with a sunroof for about $17k, maybe slightly less. The Fiesta ST would have to come with Recaros, which puts it around $22k actual purchase price based on what I have researched. That's $5k difference, which at this price point makes it a different class of vehicle.

For the same price, Fiesta every day. For $2500 difference, I'd still go Fiesta. For $5000 difference it is Sonic every time.

TheBaron2112 > Jayhawk Jake 05/12/2014 at 17:47

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THIS THING. CANNOT. ABIDE. THIS.